South Dakota rules abortions illegial.

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Shard
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Post by Shard »

Wow astra you really run the gamut! :)

My opinion is that it's better to have a quality life, then 'just' a life. It is absolutely appalling to me that couples (like your relatives) can't get an adoption through, while we then see cases of those people who stick their 'troubled' children in CAGES and force them to live in their own urine and shit. There's no justification for allowing that kind of behavior - it's not okay if you adopted someone else's child or grew it yourself... And I firmly believe that the behavior itself is being perpetuated by our own government.

I know this'll be a can of worms too, but why can't most states understand that it takes *love* and *security* to raise a family, not merely 'a mother and a father'...

In my novel, Dawnlight Chronicles (where Shard and Rue and the rest of them are from) the city has a long-instituted policy of contraception until maturity. Period. When the people with the power decide that a couple (or a woman, they're okay with that) has the stability they would want, their food supply is given additives that cancel out the contraceptives... Yes, they're quite facist but that's how they had to deal with limited space and resources.

Of course they don't TELL the people about this... and, some are immune to it... lol. :)

Myself, I am about as far away from being a breeder than ... well, I'm just not interested in children *at all*. I was worried for a while in high school too- to the point that my bf was actually kind of disappointed when it turned out to just be lateness. But even at that point, knowing that I was still a Jr in high school? I couldn't possibly have brought a child to term and continued my life. I knew I couldn't handle that. :/

But it's DEFINITELY so different for every young woman - or old woman for that matter. My jr high science teacher one year came to work in tears, because her mother - the teacher was already in her late 30s I think - who had been pregnant had spontaneously aborted the baby while on the toilet. Her body was certainly not going to be able to support another child in her mid-50s or however old she was, even if her social and financial situation would have supported her. It was so very sad seeing the reaction of my teacher to this news, we are all pretty stunned. It was something you just don't hear every day, and it certainly stayed with me for lo these 25 odd years.

anyway - the law should never make something *unsafe* for anyone. We have laws against pollution, running traffic signals, and wearing helmets in construction areas. The fact that without a law *keeping* abortion legal and monitored, will bring us right back to the 50s with unsafe conditions, death from infection, and doctors being put on the spot for their activities when all they're doing, is their job... I don't want to go to that, it's just so wrong to me.

But I absolutely agree that responsibility and education are the primary places to combat this as a problem in general. To *not* have this as an afterthought or 'oh let's not worry about it now' - it *is* something to worry about, right? And shouldn't be taken lightly. (And unfortunately, seems to be just that, in some folks!)
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Xenoqueen
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Post by Xenoqueen »

My mother's a nurse, so I get to hear horror stories of underage/rape/etc. pregancy and child abuse/neglect stories far more often than I'd like.

My stepsister is a social worker and fosters children, so I get to hear the stories of rampant breeding, child neglect/abuse, and the ridiculous nature of a system that insists on giving custody of a child to a parent WHO THE CHILD HAS EXPLICITLY SAID THEY DON'T WANT TO GO WITH. (Personal experience regarding stepsister and would-be stepnephews.)

People are messed up. The system is messed up. That's a given, and inescapable.

I'm totally pro-choice. Even in cases of stupidity. Forcing a child on unwilling parents leads to neglect and abuse, would be horrible on self-esteem (you YOU want to be born only as a punishment?), and there's already far too many children that need adopting into good homes to add even more to the "adoption pool".

That said, I also think the stigma on sex needs to be educated out of us, and replaced with common sense on how to protect oneself and one's partner. Who the hell cares if it leads to an uprising in sex itself, if it's protected?

Ramble. I'm no good at organizing my thoughts logically. XD

Guess this means I should go toddle off and make a debate/discuss forum?
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Post by Shard »

Thanks for doing so! :)
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Dray
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Post by Dray »

Sweet stuff. X3 Now we don't have to worry (I hope!) about raised tempers, considering it's more clear that what's said here isn't meant to be an attack.

Not that any of us are that gullible, or anything, but you know how debates can get the adrenaline pumping!

Thanks, Phe!
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Post by dracosinfernoweyr »

My two cents - though I think I've seen my opinions argued more eloquently then I could myself already :P

One of my friends just had an abortion last week, and up to the day she had it she seemed incredibly indifferent to the fact that she was pregnant. She still smoked and I have a strong belief that she was still drinking/doing some stronger stuff. Some one like her as a mother? Hah! No way would that child have come out healthy. It could have had Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, or the myriad of other defects drugs cause. She's obviously a first class idjit (still isn't on birth control, never makes the people she sleeps with wear a condom, and probably would sleep with anything if it held still long enough).

I think that giving a child up for adoption rather than aborting it is infinitely better, but then I've personally seen the horrible things some people do to their adopted and foster children. In spite of that, I would probably have the kid and give it up for adoption (though the thought of becoming pregnant myself is inconceivable. Really. Dubya will pull all troops from the middle east and make several witty and intelligent comments before I get pregnant. XD)

But. I will always advocate for a person's right to choose. What is that phrase? I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend to the death your right to say it? Well, I may not agree with what some people do with their lives and their bodies, but I'll definately defend their right to do it.
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The Feather
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Post by The Feather »

I'm not going to jump into this too far because it's late and I'm sleepy. :D As I was skimming through the topic, though, I saw a few references to statistics that I'd like to clear up. Most of you seem to know what you're talking about, so I'm sure the majority of you are familiar with these, but I just wanna make sure. :)

In the United States, abortion is legal for any reason right up until the moment of birth. If a woman says she wants an abortion, she gets it, assuming she's able to get herself to a doctor who will perform one. As long as the fetus is not entirely out of the womb (I'm not going to go into the legal definition of "entirely"--it's been debated), an abortion can still be performed.

7% of women who get abortions in the U.S. cite the mother's health or rape/incest as the motivation. 93% cite social reasons--i.e., the teenage mother things you guys have been discussing, or broken homes, or just whatnot. In case you're interested, the highest two categories, tied at 21% each, were "feels unready for responsibility" and "feels she can't afford baby." I tend to think those are a little misleading, because the options the polls/studies offered didn't include some of the more explicit cases that have been mentioned here.

Just to make sure we're all on the same page. If anyone doubts the veracity of anything I just said, let me know and I'll get you the applicable judicial rulings and/or statistical research.

Peace out, and g'night. :)
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Midori
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Post by Midori »

Honestly with what what Kayla said makes a good ponit my birthmother did speed for like the first three months and I have serious issues with somethings, learning issues even though people have commented how smart I am I still have issues with somethings and if I was with my birthmother I wouldn't have gotten the help with what I needed help with.

Also feather can I ponit something out even though it's legal for the whole country it can/most likely would be prossicuted by the state courts not the feddral courts. States are the ones that give out and moniter doctors licenses so even if it's legal in the contry they could be stripped of there licence in the state.

It's like pot is legal in california but the feds will come in and bust those 'legal people' just to @#%& with them insted of acttuly going after those that are using in the state without a state permit.

Out system is just royaly messed up in the states... in genral.
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Post by Mystic Dragon »

You know what's a GREAT contraceptive? Sexual alignment issues. -.- After recently being called a guy by some old man, I've come to the conclusion that I am too much /like/ a guy to get one. Therefore, I need a gay one. Yes, a gay guy. With a woman. Who acts like a man.

Someone shoot me.
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Shard
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Post by Shard »

I work with one. ... :) Sadly he's... a selampotato. *cough*

Myself I'm surprised I came out as good as I am. My mother was 39 when I was born, and at the time that was pushing it for 'fertile years'. It's changed since then, dramatically I think, but still. I could have been any number of deformities.

on the other hand, .... I really dislike the woman. She blames me for anything wrong with her life today - and compares me to my father, who I never met. SO.... yeah. I'm of two minds, but I know where I stand on the issue if it were to apply to me. I ... dooon't need a child. Anywhere near me, really... :D
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Dray
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Post by Dray »

Mystic, come up to my town. XD Full chalk to the brim with gay bois and suchforth, strangely enough considering it's one of those rich Alberta towns... >_>"
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